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40 Philipino OV10 Broncos vs Kirov

Discussion in 'History & Military Discussion' started by Louis Babycos, Jan 1, 2017.

  1. Louis Babycos

    Louis Babycos louisb Suspended

    Location:
    Usa
    The weather is good and clear with an occasional sunshower through the the day .Range Kirov is 100 miles away from Philippine mainland

    China and US are acting belligerent in the south China Sea towards each other. One diplomatic dick waiving fuck up happens after another. The Russians send a Kirov and some diplomats.

    Chinese forces and American forces launch at each other so for this scenario they are out of the fight.

    The Russians being diplomatic try to pressure the Philippines to stay out of it and threaten to launch missels at an airbase.Something goes horribly wrong and a conventional missel hits a packed shopping mall killing hundreds if not thousands.

    The Philipino launch all forty of there OV10 Broncos. Assume normal competence but exceptional bloodlust.They are all armed with as many Hellfire's as they each can carry .
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    Second scenario is a force add on the Philipino side of 6 depot condition Pegasus class patrol hydrofoil missel ships and well trained Philipino crews.
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    EDIT:TO GIVE THE BRONCOS A CHANCE THEY ARE FITTED WITH LONGBOW RADARS AND ENTRY LEVEL ECM AND RADAR GUIDED HELLFIRES
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
    • Picard Picard x 2
  2. The Kirov is toast? And why Hellfires and not Exocets or somesuch
     
  3. Louis Babycos

    Louis Babycos louisb Suspended

    Location:
    Usa
    Are broncos big enough to carry an Exocet?
    I specified Hellfire's because OV10s are rated to carry them now.

    Kirov's airdefence are really good. The OV10s are slow,the Hellfire's aren't stealthy and have short range.

    How many OV10 Broncos would be shot down?
     
  4. If Puccaras could be jury rigged to carry one I don't see why the Bronco can't.
     
  5. SeaDart

    SeaDart Ritsu, I'm already a demon

    The Bronco has no radar, it won't be able to designate a surface target for the Exocet, whereas Hellfire is Laser-guided. You /can/ fire harpoons blind with waypoints and have it use its own seeker on terminal approach, but that's pushing it w.r.t the Bronco and I'm not sure Exocet has that capability.

    That being said, subsonic prop-aircraft with no stand-off capability? Kirov wouldn't have much of a problem at all cleaning house

    >'Philipino crews'
    >well trained
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
  6. Louis Babycos

    Louis Babycos louisb Suspended

    Location:
    Usa
    Also fly those broncos low wave top height.

    Add in the 6 Pegasus patrol missel hydrofoil ships in depot conditions with freshened electronics and harpoons (lastest block freshened seekers)
     
  7. SeaDart

    SeaDart Ritsu, I'm already a demon

    At 'wavetop height' they'd have an even worse time of even trying to find the Kirov, and will still enter her radar horizon (~12nm) long before they are within weapons range.

    I see we are in the realm of fiction

    Its quite likely they have a better time of it than the Bronco, you can fire harpoon along ESM bearing lines, but considering the strong AA defence of a Kirov and the relatively weak ECM/ECCM of FACMs its unlikely they'd hurt the larger ship operating by themselves.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  8. Jemnite

    Jemnite Atlanta is ours, and fairly won.

    I think we first have to consider that all but 10 of the broncos are going to be nonoperational because the PAF has been letting its fighter force just rot due to a combination of lack of funding and ineptness (of which the latter corruption played a large part.)

    Then we consider that the Broncos have no radar (the marines fitted theirs with radar, but that was an ad hoc modification, I doubt the ones given to the PAF have any). Absolutely none. Most AshMs are now barred to them, and they'll have a hard time patrolling to even spot the Kirov in the first place, which most definitely has radar and can spot them coming from quite a ways off. According to reports, the Broncos have been modified to fire various smart weapons like hellfires and such, but again, relying on pure laser designation they'll have to travel quite a bit into the Kirov's radar horizon. Add in they have very little ECM countermeasures (OV-10D was the first to put in countermeasures and the PAF only got the A and the C variants), and have a top speed of under 300 mph with not super great kinematics (being a light attack and observation duel engined turboprop), and it's already not looking all that great.

    And then we remember that the AA complement of the Kirov is ridiculous. They carry fucking 96 S-300s, 128 Tor PD missiles, 40 SA-8s, and 6 or more CWIS guns per ship (depending on variant). Plus they're lightly armored and have splinter protection.

    The PAF is fucked, yo. There's a reason that they cling on to the USN for protection.
     
    • Insightful Insightful x 5
    • Funny Funny x 1
  9. Louis Babycos

    Louis Babycos louisb Suspended

    Location:
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    That's why there are Broncos as well.For this exercise we will be generous and give them longbow radars and corresponding radar guided Hellfire's.
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
  10. SeaDart

    SeaDart Ritsu, I'm already a demon

    The Broncos couldn't find the Kirov and ran out of fuel, or blundered into the Kirov and got shot down.

    We went over this already
     
  11. Louis Babycos

    Louis Babycos louisb Suspended

    Location:
    Usa
    We are going to assume longbow radar equalent radars for the Broncos and there hellfires. All forty are good working flyable conditions.

    Bronco range is 560 miles. They know the rough direction of the Kirov due to the errant missel attack.

    Assume also they have been fitted with entry level ECM.
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
  12. What result are you looking for, here? If the forces involved just keep getting increased every time they aren't up to the task, what (if anything) does this tell us about the OP?

    Can 40 Broncos blow up the Kirov? The answer is they probably couldn't find it and Kirov is well-equipped to handle them.
     
  13. Should be in range of ground based radar?
     
  14. Jemnite

    Jemnite Atlanta is ours, and fairly won.

    Okay. I'm going to assume that that's like chaff or flares or some shit. And if they have radar, they'll be able to hit them at farther ranges with the hellfire, right? The hellfire has uh, around 7kms worth of range? 8km? And uh, let's check the Kirov classes's TOR ran- oh, 12km you say? That's uh, quite bit longer range than the hellfire.

    And uh, what's this you say? The Kirov has 128 TOR missiles and quite a lot of launchers? And they all carry more than 6 CWIS guns? That could intercept a hellfire missile up to 5-6kms out? And we're not even talking about the 96 theater range missiles the Kirov carries? The Broncos don't travel at nearly as fast enough speeds to or have the armament to overwhelm the large amount of CWIS guns that the Kirov carries (even if we assume that the PAF can launch 40).

    I don't really think there's a scenario that would ever allow the PAF to defeat even one Kirov class battlecruiser. You're better off just putting the USN against the Kirov rather than mutating the PAF until it's no longer the PAF and just the USN.
     
  15. ussnimitz1968

    ussnimitz1968 Not an Actual Servicemember

    Maybe theoretically Bronco can carry Exocet but certainly at the very least the PhAF would need time and extensive fabrication to set it up. Either way, Kirov has some rather powerful air defenses when assumed fully operational.

    I'd appreciate a source to verify that.
     
  16. Louis Babycos

    Louis Babycos louisb Suspended

    Location:
    Usa
    Yes
     
  17. Ops sorry :oops:

    I was under the impression pucaras launched them during the Falklands war but turns out I was mistaken.
     
  18. ussnimitz1968

    ussnimitz1968 Not an Actual Servicemember

    I believe all Argentinian air-launched Exocets were from Super Etendards, which is why those assets were so critical (likewise for the Iraqis, although they did attempt to modify a Falcon bizjet into an Exocet platform). The British attempted to disable that capability through sabotage but obviously failed at it. I think they landed some ship-mounted box launchers and attempted to use it as a shore battery but I'm not sure.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  19. DonBosco

    DonBosco Dread Lord of the Luddites

    The most likely result is that they never even spot the Kirov. The second most likely result is that several of them get splashed while again never spotting the Kirov.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  20. galahad

    galahad Seeker of Truths

    Imagine 40 men armed with throwing knives charging a machine gun bunker. Thats what the scenario is.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  21. DonBosco

    DonBosco Dread Lord of the Luddites

    That's being far too generous. It's more like charging the machine bunker with butter knifes while blindfolded.
     
  22. Commander 598

    Commander 598 Tailhook Representative

    Also only about 10 of them could be equipped with knives due to budget issues.
     
  23. ussnimitz1968

    ussnimitz1968 Not an Actual Servicemember

    More like hand grenades, those Hellfires especially in those numbers can seriously wreck Kirov. The only problem is bringing those Hellfires into range.
     
  24. Project30bis

    Project30bis Sells Farms to Loaders

    Location:
    N. America
    Hellfires carry, what, 20 pounds of explosives? A destroyer took two P-15s to go down, and those have about 1,000 pounds of explosive each.
     
  25. Louis Babycos

    Louis Babycos louisb Suspended

    Location:
    Usa
    The Broncos could carry at least 4 each.
    Also you don't need to sink it . You have to take it out of the fight.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2017
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