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Politics The Crimes of SEAL Team 6 [Investigative Journalism]

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by prometheus110, Jan 11, 2017 at 10:47 AM.

  1. prometheus110

    prometheus110 Join Cayman-Global & be part of the 1E-9 percent!


    Officially known as the Naval Special Warfare Development Group, SEAL Team 6 is today the most celebrated of the U.S. military’s special mission units. But hidden behind the heroic narratives is a darker, more troubling story of “revenge ops,” unjustified killings, mutilations, and other atrocities — a pattern of criminal violence that emerged soon after the Afghan war began and was tolerated and covered up by the command’s leadership.



    ON THE AFTERNOON of March 6, 2002, Lt. Cmdr. Vic Hyder and more than two dozen operators from SEAL Team 6 boarded two Chinook helicopters en route to eastern Afghanistan hoping that within hours, they would kill or capture Osama bin Laden.

    Earlier that evening, general officers from the Joint Special Operations Command had scrambled the SEALs after watching a Predator drone video feed of a man they suspected was bin Laden set off in a convoy of three or four vehicles in the Shah-i-Kot Valley, where al Qaeda forces had fortified themselves. Although the video had revealed no weapons, and the generals had only tenuous intelligence that the convoy was al Qaeda...

    [Much More Here]
    Matthew Cole - Additional Credits:: Ryan Gallagher, John Thomason, Margot Williams, and Sheelagh McNeill - The Intercept

    Well, this is completely fucked up.

    I know a lot of this information has come out in bits and pieces over the years (I distinctly recall @MJ12 Commando discussing the details mentioned in the CIA section a while back, for instance), but I don't think that anything this comprehensive has ever been released about the SEALs' war crimes. Some of this stuff, like the skinnings, attempted beheadings, and other forms of mutilation are completely beyond the pale when it comes to our expectations of how soldiers (at least those from nations that aren't failed states or dictatorships) are supposed to behave.

    Some of the other stuff is straight out mind boggling, too. The hatchets and the apparently serious belief some SEALs hold that they turn into, no shit, native America warriors is particularly crazy, with the self-aggrandizement being a close runner-up.
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  2. primemountain


    "Well they sure brought freedom to them filthy terrorists. America, fuck yeah!", excerpt from SEAL team 6 interview, conducted by Reporter Hypo Crissy from the "Sarcasm Weekly".

    The background of said hypotetical front page would likely be an eagle with guns and explosions all around it. It's an old joke, but I find it less then amusing right now.

    It's one thing to be apathetic to suffereing ala "We made them fear clear skies" but this is mutilation of dead bodies bad. It's just a step away from the moral bedrock of "Well we sold them for parts" bad. In an elite unit that has been celebrated as the best of the best.

    If true, the lines wright themselves. "If this is your best, what are the rest like?" etc.

    Can we get some confirmation that this is real investigative journalism, and not fake news? Because, boy does this seem bad. Cartoonishly evil bad. This can't be real, right? Anybody?
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017 at 1:52 PM
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  3. MJ12 Commando

    MJ12 Commando Shadow Cabal Barristerminator

    This tracks with what Ambinder said in Deep State about the CIA and JSOC in the Middle East-the CIA repeatedly complained about how JSOC's special forces, including the SEALs, were off the reservation doing shit which was too immoral for the CIA. So, real or false it has some ring of truth to it.
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  4. NothingNow

    NothingNow Florida Man

    Honestly, it's pretty believable, especially given everything else that's been said. A couple nutjobs in leadership positions and a code of silence will destroy any preexisting organizational culture pretty quickly.

    Toss in rapid growth and a high operational tempo, and I'm really surprised this took as long as it did to come out, classification or not.

    That said, taking scalps isn't that odd. It's been featured in literature pretty heavily, even if it hasn't been a major practice for anyone since the Indian wars ended. Of course someone who goes and glorifies the whole native warrior thing is going to start doing that after he goes nuts.
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  5. Omicron

    Omicron "I already have dragons, I do not want men." Councillor

    I think it may be less a question of being too immoral for the CIA and more of the nature of the immorality. The CIA fancies itself hard men taking on a cold-blooded, deliberately callous outlook to protect the country. It's easy to justify a lot of shady shit under that outlook; but mutilating dead enemies, taking trophies, carrying hatchets on the battlefield and using them to finish off enemies, keeping scrapbooks of your best post-mortem headshots - that just isn't their deal. It's too, hm, visceral, psychotic, it's not something you can justify as having ruthless purpose. It's just self-gratification. It's not the kind of immorality they've justified to themselves as being acceptable.
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  6. There is also the fact that CIA is supposed to be an Intelligence agency, this sort of behaviour closes door for asset finding.
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  7. The CIA is only loosely an intelligence agency. Their primary activities throughout their history have been active interference in other nations via black ops activity. It's why they kind of suck at intelligence and foist off most of their work to the NSA and FBI for international and domestic spywork respectively.

    Honestly if this turns out to be true it is both not surprising and deeply disappointing. No wonder its impossible to 'win hearts and minds' when you have roving bands of torture hobos acting like this in various nations.
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  8. MJ12 Commando

    MJ12 Commando Shadow Cabal Barristerminator

    Murder hobos, thank you very much. The report suggests most of the war crimes involved murder and corpse mutilation, versus torturing living people.
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  9. To pay lip service to concept requires the awareness of it. Hence my supposed to comment.
  10. Cloak&Dagger

    Cloak&Dagger Definitely Insane

    I've gotten the impression that paganism and similar religions viewed as 'warlike' have a disproportionate population size in the military, is that the case?
  11. Alex


    I don't think its anything that complicated or mystical, it seems common in militaries to compare yourself and your comrades to ancient warrior peoples or specific successful conquerors. the number of generals and leaders throughout history who felt they had a connection with Alexander the great is astounding. hell the opening lines of the British Grenadiers compares themselves to classical and mythological heroes.
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  12. Reveen

    Reveen Dunked On

    I'm sure there are tons of armchair warrior assholes who are just jacking it over this, some of them in public office. As if it doesn't even occur to them that borderline psychotic special forces units could ever possibly be turned against the American people.

    Not saying it will happen, but we're completely complacent in our surety that our country won't one day go tinpot on us.

    It's also common in Americans (and Canadians to be fair), usually white as snow, to claim that they're totally 1/10000th Apache or Mohawk or whatever and clearly some people go off the fucking reservation enough that they actually think they have the Eagle Warrior blood pumping in their veins or some shit.
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017 at 5:15 PM
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  13. Mithras

    Mithras Misanthrope

    Perhaps they have the Garland Wars Unique Tech which allows them to have +4 attack. :V
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  14. US forces supposedly did the whole trophy collecting and taking scalps in ww2 pacific too.
    American mutilation of Japanese war dead - Wikipedia
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  15. Dream Logic

    Dream Logic Best Worst Person

    Eagle warriors were Aztec so not really america's area. Fairly certain aztecs were big on slave'ing so they probably didn't want to kill everyone they met.
  16. Hey @Strypgia, I know you can't tell us any specifics, but can you give us a general impression on what you think of the article and of the particular alphabet-soup agencies like DevGru or the different JSOC task forces?
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  17. A few hundred men were used in an insane operational tempo for over a decade? with kills measuring in the hundreds? for each. Small wonder some went crazy and they developed their own "unique" warrior culture.
  18. Yes the US forces did a lot a head hunting and turning the bones of their enemies into trophies during the pacific war but then common Americans at the time tended to viewed the japanese as ranging from inferior to subhuman monsters even before the attack on pear harbor and those attitudes only got worse after the war started which was a massive pain for US intelligence and the allied high command but was not helped by american propaganda.

    That was a very long time ago though and things have changed since then both in the military and general american society.
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  19. Reveen

    Reveen Dunked On

    Yuh huh. I'll believe it when the common American starts actually giving a shit about the atrocities of their military.
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  20. primemountain


    Welp, thanks for the background. I'm kind of stunned.

    It's just, they're SEAL's. The heroes. The good guys in every war movie. Every spy movie. Yeah, I get it, war is hell, and there will allways be assholes who get off on pain and suffering. But in the elite? In the people you put on recruitment posters? The ones tauted on TV and in movies as the heroes?

    The sheer mood whiplash, the backlash is... bad. If true, it's a massive black mark on the honor of the US armed forces, and a massive crack in the image of the US as good guys in the propaganda war.

    This isn't some spy black ops bullshit. These people may be spec ops but as far as I can tell they are not part of the CIA "Special Operations Group", which are actual black ops teams. They are navy spec ops, which makes them fall under the Uniform Code of Military Justice, based on the Articles of War.

    If the news is real, they shattered those, and as long as they are not tried and convicted, the US Army, Navy and Air Force are blackened by protecting them. Far more dangerously, right now only crazies like ISIS will torture US personel that they take as POW, as things stand.But shit like this? It tears down what little civilization has been able to do to reduce suffering in war.

    And the monsters, if the news is true? They might just join up thinking it's a place where they can relax and just live out their sick fantasies. And if enough of them do it, some of the will slip on by and make more headlines like this. More ruined lives. Or the rank and file might see lack of punishment as tacit approval.

    It's corruption and it rots things from the inside. It's at its most dangerous when it affects symbols that have been raised up as examples to look up to.

    If this is true there needs to be an outcry from the ordinary soldier and civilian for court martials. So that actual court martials happen. This stuff matters. You know what else is a war crime? Use of chemical weapons, or WMDs. Entire wars have been started, multiple of them, on the premise that somebody broke the rules of war.

    The the biggest military in the world(Larger then the next 10 combined I think?) breaking them? Now that's scary. And scared people do stupid shit. Get them scared enough and they'll do really stupid shit. Like use bio/chem/Nuclear weapons on civilian targets. Or other shit likely to start WW3. I've allready been through one war. Could we not go again?

    Because we've seen how the US reacts to a minor incident like 9/11(minor in terms of global warfare between nation states ala WW3). I'd hate to learn what they would do if one of their major(1 000 000+Pop) cities went up in smoke.
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  21. FBH

    FBH Write drunk. Edit Hungover

    Most Special Ops units do various kind of bad shit, and the SEALs have a bit of a rep for being indiscipline and over macho.

    So, not really surprising.
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  22. Triggerhappy

    Triggerhappy Hard Knocks University

    Didn't it come out that at least one SEAL team suffered heavy losses in Afghanistan because the team leader refused to coordinate with other units in the area?

    Something to do with that one soldier who was taken in and sheltered by local Afghani's for a few days.
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  23. Skyllian Blitz

    Skyllian Blitz Shadow Cabal Member Moderator

    I'll have to find the posts but it's been mentioned before on SB or SV that the other US spec ops units don't like working with Seal Team 6.
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  24. Oh look the US is proving why I glorify Kopassus and the SAS more than their Spec Ops. Cool.

    More seriously, if this gets out... People are going to go hysterical and your new president is just going to do his headbobbing and point at Obama.
  25. Skyllian Blitz

    Skyllian Blitz Shadow Cabal Member Moderator

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